Missionary Moment

A couple weeks ago a friend and I ran into the missionaries while we were waiting for the bus. We all got on, and they stroke up a conversation.

Oh yes; I know about the Mormons... I used to go to church... I stopped going. Yeah!

My pal? She's Catholic. No sale there.

I do wish them the best though, since they weren't bad people (as far as I could tell) I think I've seen them around (the Swiss Army knapsack looks familiar) and considering they generally come from White Town USA, coming to my area must be a culture shock.

Operation: Pedopreist

"You have to control the operations: estabilish a code of silence and hide the scandal until the media attention moves elsewhere!" Play it here

This game is based on real-life "controversies [about] the sexual abuses committed by the priests. The Vatican created a task force to prevent sinners from being captured and put on trial according to the secular states' laws."

Unfriendly Friend

I was talking to a friend I've known for years, since we were young teenagers, about religion. Now neither of us were overtly religious, nor made to go to services, from the time we met; but this person has always had a side she defines as 'spiritual' and recently has explored it more.

According to her, I'm not knowledgeable about religion because I am "a crazy Mormon", even though I never had a personal testimony and was involved with the Catholic church for years, even going to a Catholic school. I've also researched many different faiths, both in school and for leisure.

I think what it often comes down to is that if you are not a True Believer you have no idea about the essence of faith. I see it as (at least to an extent) a social construct, with many political, racial, classist, gendered and heteronomative aspects. It's so easy to say "It's true and right because I believe it" without thinking about how the institution you back affects yourself and others.


There was more that I wanted to say, but wanting to forget the incident, I didn't write anything down or even contemplate about it until a couple days after the fact.

Interesting Info

A day after my last entry, I come across some information regarding the Catholic church and their views on female roles.

"A Vatican spokesman said the decree [against the ordination of female priests on Thursday] made the church’s existing ban on female priests more explicit by clarifying that excommunication would follow all such ordinations"
- source

Trans Troubles

This is a good discussion on how transsexuals are treated by the LDS church. It starts off explaining general facets of the church, and relates their beliefs to gendered/sex discrimination (starting about 3:30)

One of the many things that made me hate being a female in church (other then the dresses) was that we would never hold the same power as men... Not saying the Catholic church doesn't have problems embracing feminism, but at least they started to allow girls to help with the sacrament and women hold positions which help with the running of the church (beyond the bake and clothing sale)



Mormons don't really do the sale stuff. I guess they view it as irreverent, but it has the result of creating a lack of community. Sure, there are sometimes firesides after dinner at a members house (= not accessible to everyone) and events throughout the week, but unless you have the ability to go there - hard if you don't live near the church, don't have a car, or have an inflexible or late work schedule - it's difficult to participate.

If you're even slightly deviant - not being a good enough male provider by having a job that gives you the luxury of leaving early for sports night in the cultural hall, with no worries about being laid off, and the money to ensure you reside in a "good" neighbourhood (= by the chapel); not being a proper female homemaker who, should have no job outside the home, has the time to take her children to activities; not being a nice grandparent who can look after the younger ones while their adult children tend to the church duty of preparing food platters in the meetinghouse kitchen - If you don't fall into the highly gendered and classist life script, it will be harder to engage in church life.

Perhaps that's the (implicit) point; the LDS church is made for those that do.

Cult Criteria

I've seen a lot of discussion about religion and cults lately, especially in relation to Scientology; however everything I've read could also be attributed to Mormonism. There are a couple points I see as problematic, despite how in this case they're true.


A 'new' church is likely to be a cult

I guess this falls under the "cult as 'a group with ideas contrary to the general population" At one point Jesus' ideas were considered really radical (to the point that (assuming he was a real person/entity) he was murdered) so I guess that would make the Big One a cult.

Personally, I think all organized religion is cultist, but for the sake of argument (illustrating true, negative cult behaviour) I focused on what the general population would define as a "cult", even though it's hard to make a distinction... It boils down to personal perception. I admit having gone to LDS church is "weird" (and very boring!) but to others (especially those who didn't go to church as children) it's more "creepy". I can see how others raised in religion may see their mainstream, generally non-abusive (at least in an overt, physical manner) religion as different then a "real" cult like the Branch Davidians or Heaven's Gate.

But I digress; if Scientology is a cult because it's only been around for about fifty years, a couple hundred years isn't much longer.


A cult has a charismatic leader who must be followed

Even though L Ron and David Miscavage are more interesting then Joe Smith and Ezra Benson, you must still always Follow The Prophet... One of the reasons some people are opposed to Catholicism is because of the "must be followed" rule regarding the Pope, who is seen as an idol (along with Mary and saints) other then Jesus. I've heard this comment from many LDS folk, who see nothing wrong with practically worshiping Smithy Boy.

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Here's an interesting and insightful account of an ex-Scientologist who was in the Sea Org... There is no LDS-equivalent to the Sea Org, because the latter are missionaries for life, and their next life and the next and so-on, due to a billion year contract (Even the Mormons don't have "legal" documents like that)

"Your Mormon Overlord is dead"

Those words, from my boyfriend who was reading Fark, was how I found out about the biggest news in The Kingdom.

I saw him speak in the late 90s and I was awed at how old he was. He was born before at least one of my grandparents, yet even at that time, he had outlived them (this person never smoked and I don't think they ever drank either, save for mass, so it's not an argument for the Word of Wisdom)

Regardless of lifestyle, everyone has to die at some point. For Gordo, this was his.

Flying from the Fear

One part (2:27) really stood out to me, since I had a similar experience.
"You go to church and they're all like 'Do you accept God?' 'Do you believe God is in your heart?' and if you say 'no' ...Am I supposed to hear a little man inside my head? A voice telling me he loves me? ...Well, no; I didn't feel that... I don't feel anything when I go to church. That automatically made me think I was going to hell cause I didn't hear this little man in my head telling me stuff"

Smithmas

I've read it from other bloggers, and at least for me, it was True (if anything about The Church could be) that the lessons focused on Joseph, or lessons on the Chapel and Book of Mormon, instead of Jesus during the Christian celebration of the winter season.

By the time I got to Young Womans, I was rarely in class enough - let alone paying attention when I was - to analyze and comprehend anything they were attempting to indoctrinate me with. In Primary I do recall the lectures. They focused on the Smith story, even though they told us about 'Him' throughout the rest of the year.

At least in the Catholic church, they were half an hour at most and generally consisted of being given an interesting coloured lesson sheet, often including colouring sheets, and they had special Christmas stuff that consisted of more then a dinner with cold pastas and salads in the activity hall that seconds as a basketball court (and in some chapels, thirds as overflow for Sacrament)

Taking the Piss

Mapping out my un-religiosity

These quizzes are fairly accurate.

What Religion Am I?
1. Secular Humanism (100%)
2. Unitarian Universalism (91%)
3. Nontheist (79%)
4. Theravada Buddhism (72%)
5. Liberal Quakers (69%)
6. Neo-Pagan (60%)
7. Mainline to Liberal Christian Protestants (55%)
8. New Age (44%)
9. Reform Judaism (41%)
10. Taoism (37%)
11. Mahayana Buddhism (32%)
12. New Thought (31%)
13. Scientology (31%)
14. Orthodox Quaker (24%)
15. Sikhism (24%)
16. Christian Science (Church of Christ, Scientist) (23%)
17. Bahá'í Faith (19%)
18. Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints (Mormons) (16%)
19. Mainline to Conservative Christian/Protestant (13%)
20. Eastern Orthodox (11%)
21. Hinduism (11%)
22. Islam (11%)
23. Jainism (11%)
24. Orthodox Judaism (11%)
25. Roman Catholic (11%)
26. Seventh Day Adventist (8%)
27. Jehovah's Witness (5%)

Which religion is the right one for you?
You scored as Satanism. Your beliefs most closely resemble those of Satanism! Before you scream, do a bit of research on it. To be a Satanist, you don't actually have to believe in Satan. Satanism generally focuses upon the spiritual advancement of the self, rather than upon submission to a deity or a set of moral codes. Do some research if you immediately think of the satanic cult stereotype. Your beliefs may also resemble those of earth-based religions such as paganism.
Satanism - 88%
Paganism - 63%
Buddhism - 46%
agnosticism - 25%
Judaism - 21%
Hinduism - 17%
Christianity - 8%
Islam - 0%

What kind of atheist are you?
You scored as Angry Atheist. Whoah! Down boy! It's time to let go of the belligerence and let someone else talk for a while. Even if the religious don't make must sense, you should probably observe the unspoken rules for human interaction and not yell directly into their faces.
Angry Atheist - 92%
Scientific Atheist - 75%
Militant Atheist - 75%
Spiritual Atheist - 58%
Apathetic Atheist - 58%
Agnostic - 42%
Theist - 25%

Ten Weird Things

I decided to keep it related to religion, since that's the topic of this blog

1. That I was raised both Roman Catholic and Latter Day Saint. They may be both Christian churches, but normally both of those sects don't like marriages outside them.

2. That I was baptised into two churches - LDS and Catholic - while attending both.

3. That I was allowed to stop going to church before I was age of majority. Normally Mormon parents, and some Catholic ones, are really strict when it comes to attendance.

4. That, at least when I was older (post-baptism) I was vocal about not having a testimony. Usually people who doubt aren't open about it (It may also be why #3 was an option for me)

5. That I sometimes didn't wear a dress or skirt to the Mormon church, which is looked down upon (Also possibly contributing to why #3 was allowed) While many women wore those clothes to the Catholic church, especially for the Sunday morning service, wearing pants wasn't shunned.

6. That I never "felt the spirit" even though I came from a long line of True Believers. Maybe some of them secretly doubted; As a kid I often thought "do these people really believe this shit?" so maybe some of it subconsciously rubbed off onto me.

7. That I felt pro-choice and pro-queer, before I was even taught anything about those topics (and when I was, it was that abortion and homosexuality was wrong) Coming from a religious household and where my other family members and few close friends were also religious, I don't know where I could have been exposed to such "radical" ideas.

8. That I was allowed to watch rated-R movies from a young age. Catholics tend shun from that sort of entertainment, but Mormons are explicitly told not to seek it out; but then again, violence is okay so long as there's no sex involved.

9. That my first concert attendance was to see the Beach Boys, who apparently have ties with the devil

10. That there was never any green gelatin at any Mormon event I went to. Isn't that stuff supposed to be a staple?

I admit, by the last few, I was fishing for ideas. Despite going to a "peculiar" church and growing up around equally peculiar people, I can't think of many weird things regarding religion. Then again, growing up in and around it may have made me immune to what others - such as my partner, who was raised in a mainly secular family - see as insanity, or at least sheer idiocy.

Hell-oween Hoopla

Thankfully, I was able to celebrate Halloween like a normal kid; going out dressed up to go door-to-door for candy, then coming home to unload my bag and have it be inspected while a parent and I (or as I got older, a friend or a few and myself) went back out for more.

I can recall a Halloween celebration at the chapel [I can now add one more positive thing in regards to church] where they opened up the basement storage area, normally off-limits, as a haunted house. This wasn't like a Catholic Hell House, but an actual attempt at a spooky interior; full with little light, spider webs and one of those 'creepy music' tapes generally heard at the house with awesome candy that, despite being told not to re-visit, you can't help but go back (the sins of gluttony, envy and greed)

Since my cup is only half full (Really; the cup of juice beside my keyboard is half empty) the bad stuff should be included:

The holiday allowed for the discussion of "evil" within church, somewhat in lessons but mostly through general comments amongst the congregation. I don't remember much of these talks, but the thesis was Halloween = bad and you can get snacks *and* cool toys at Christmas - of course keeping the virgin birth as the focal point of the season spent tearing open gifts under the tree and shoving your face full of sugar cookies and chocolate.

Both holidays are pagan, but only one is bastardized by Christianity. Maybe if Christians were able to make Halloween 'theirs' - like as a way for them to "evade the evil spirits which plague this earth, I tells you, like this devil child, a little kid, dressed like the devil, came and demanded candy from my doorstep! What is this here world coming to?" - they would be less likely to lash out against it. On the other hand, I like having a holiday that is for everyone; you don't have to be religious to celebrate it but even if you are religious the only thing stopping you from celebrating it is yourself.

One of my pet peeves is people talking about x-mas / giftmas / non-denominational seasonal time before Halloween, so I'll end this post now with a hearty HAPPY HALLOWEEN

Communion, complete with cheese pizza

I realize that this blog is pretty negative, so to balance things out a bit I'll write about something positive.

The best church memory I have was eating pizza at a 'party' in the basement of the Catholic church. It was to commemorate my first communion, which I later wasn't able to participate in due to familial conflict (But religion is supposed to bring people together!) For some reason it was permissible for me to partake in sacrament, the Mormon equilivent to communion, but not at the Catholic church.

The most positive thing that religion provided me was a few slices of pizza and some pop; and this was supposed to be a non-negative post.

Domino's Pizza, which was created by a very right-wing Christian, happens to be my favourite (Other then Pizza Hut, which apparently is Mormon-run)

Day of Deception

I came across a website for pro-Mormon movies and saw something strange.

This advert for "Day of Defense" shows two clearly Mormon (white short sleeved dress shirts, ties and black badges) whereas this ad depicts several business-looking men, who to the unindoctrinated eye could easily not be Mormon. On the right are two Catholic preists, one of whom has a beard (which is a no-no in Mormon culture) I find this juxtaposition interesting seeing as it is Jesus who is supposed to be on the right side of the father, which in this case could be the patriarchal Mormon leaders (a view some may see as blasphemous, but those people would probably feel the same way about this entire blog)

Now I know it's normal to tailor your advertising to your audience, but why hide the fact that the protagonists are Mormon in what is probably the non-Utah ads?

Mormons are notorious for editing films. After all, adults aren't able to watch videos rated higher then PG-13

I've been unable to find the movie on BitTorrent sites, but hopefully I'll be able to find it at one of the local indie video stores (seeing as their shelves are full of very non-LDS type films, it's a long shot (and I refuse to use CockBlockbuster, which happens to be Mormon owned)) so it might be up soon.

Titleless Thoughts

This Mormon Curtian article questions whether certian people would be better off without Mormonism.

I'm better without it, without a doubt, but for those who have their entire identity entwined with The Church it may be different. I feel this way in regards to most of my relatives, especially as I've gotten older.

When I was a young child my inner voice said "this is bogus" whenever they'd pray, or tell me stories of how some great thing had happened in response to their prayers. When I was a bit older I'd question them, asking "Are you sure it was because of the prayer? Maybe it was just a coincidence?" they'd deny it (since god is everywhere, or something like that) Even the out-there stories about the garments. They weren't urban myths or something with another explination, such as the fire not having enough time to burn through their clothing; No, they were True and Real Facts.

Snopes only gave one hit about LDS legends. They don't say either way, alluding to people's personal truths.

Despite what I'd label as a false consciousness, my relatives (at least some of them) are (sometimes) happy. It may be my responsibility to tell them, both Mormon and Catholic, what I see as the truth (as much as something subjective like my version of reality can be) but it is also their right to live their life as they see fit. Since I'd want them to 'let it live' towards me, I should do the same.


As I was typing this, I was listening to Combichrist's "Enjoy The Abuse", Apoptygma Berzerk's "You Keep Me From Breaking Apart" and Assemblage 23's "Sorry". Pretty fitting for this entry (The first two remind me of some of my relatives relationships with others and their religion, and the last describes mine)

Media Madness

The bible sure is a silly book, as is shown with Peter's interpertation of Exodus and Leviticus

And Satan is Searching for Soles

(Another parody (and therefore legal under Fair Use laws) of a movie - this time from The Devil Wears Prada - taken off Free Image Hosting servers. Again, I don't have a copy of this image to re-upload.)


I apologize for the lack of entries lately. I've been working alot (and working at finding more work) and as a result my weekends are mostly spent getting drunk. Since I'm not religious I can drink and not have to worry about being hungover Sunday morning.

Religious Refrain

Back when I went to church I generally listened to rock and classical (weird mix, I know) so the music played there bored me not only due to it's religious aspect but the monotonous harmonies.

Despite how many other bloggers describe remembering the church songs many years later, I had enough trouble recalling the words when I was sitting on the hard plastic Primary chair. Perhaps this was because I was daydreaming and counting down the hours and mintues to when church would end. Perhaps it was also that since third grade I only attended twice monthly, when visiting my Mormon parent.

In the Catholic chapel all of the songs had religious connotations, but I remember really liking a song that went like, "though the mountains may fall and the hills turn to dust, the love of the lord will stand, as a shelter to all who will call on his name, sing the praise and the glory of god" Even though at that point I was agnostic, leaning on the atheist side, I still looked forward to when this song was on the playlist.

I didn't like any songs sung in Sacrement, especially when I started attending the Catholic church, which while bland was energetic compared to the Mormon sermon. The Primary song that I enjoyed was "Popcorn Popping on the Apricot Tree", firstly because it was silly but secondly since it had nothing to do with religion, which the Mormon church showed me more then anything that it was something to be shunned.

This is the same hymn book used when I went to church. According to Deseret Books, it's been in circulation since the 80s

All Shit Smells The Same

At my new job I had a chat with a coworker, which got me thinking about how all religions are basically the same.

I cannot think of any religion which does not promote kindness. Even Satanists, who are often villified as being against this, discuss showing compassion to children, animals and others and demands that one is aware of ones potential, both good and bad.

My co-worker informed me of the 3 ways of Buddhism elicited by their god, and it reminded me alot of Mormonism.

The first is the dharmakaya, which is considered the absolute and unborn truth. In Mormonism this could be described as the Celestial kingdom, which one can attain by being the best and believing in what they see as the true gospel.

The second, samboghakaya, is a state of enjoyment and involves "timeless communication". This might be seen in Mormon terms as the Terrestrial glory, where everyone exists in bliss and are able to connect with Jesus (I have heard conflicting accounts; either he lives on this plane, or visits peridocially)

The third, nirmanakaya, is our "phemenological reality". From what I was taught, the Telestial kingdom will still surpass anything in our materialist imagination, but on this plane one would be disconnected from the godhead, making it more like our earthly state.

Sorry for no picture. I couldn't even think of a proper tag for this post

This is Bishop Rick's take on how the Christian and Buddhist gods are similar.

Baptism Bullshit

Since one cannot be baptised as a Mormon until the age of 8, I was not baptised in the Catholic religion until that age as well.

At that point I was pretty agnostic, but thought there couldn't be any harm in being baptised. I thought it would put me in the clear for going to heaven/higher kingdom and it would make my family happy.

The Catholic baptism was more foreign, as the basin was made for an infant. I had seen some Mormon baptisms previous to mine, and children are introduced to the ritual through pictures and stories from a young age. I didn't have the same exposure to the more traditional chrisitan rites; At that point I didn't think Mormons were christian, as I was told that by family who were members (which apparently is inproper doctrune)

This image was a common sight in my chapel.

I was 'dunked' on my 8th birthday, by my full preisthood holding father. I don't have a strong memory of it, as one often does of a memorable experience. I just remember going through the motions and not feeling fully comfortable with it, as with any other church experience.

After one's baptism they give the Holy Ghost to the recipient. I remember closing my eyes and trying to focus, thinking maybe this will be the time everything would be revealed to me; It was not, and I was left with more doubt then before.


More thoughts on the holy ghost and baptism to come....

Catholic on Mormonism

This video is quite open minded, considering all the inter-Christian, hen-pecking to be ontop of the bullshit mountain.

While I don't personally agree with either position, it's interesting to see the connections between Catholicism and Mormonism since in my experience both tend to distance themselves from one another.